WikiDiscuss

WikiDiscuss


Controversial points in the morphology

posts: 14214

On Fri, Feb 11, 2005 at 12:49:47PM -0800, wikidiscuss@lojban.org
wrote:
>
> Issue1: Consonant clusters.
>
> The current PEG allows initial clusters of up to three consonants
> (spr, ckl, jgl, zdr and the like) and non-initial clusters of up
> to four consonants, which are formed by a consonant followed
> by an initial cluster. That's for fuhivla.

Erm, the tststswhateverthehell example had rather a lot more. What
happened?

> In addition to that there is the crunchy cluster allowed in type-3
> fuhivla only. In cmene there is no restriction beyond permissible
> pairs and no ntc, ndj, nts, ndz.

As I've said elsewhere, I'd like to see limitation to triples
except, where syllabic consonants don't count.

I do not support aligning cmene with fu'ivla (or anything else)
morphologically; we already fuck with people's names enough.

> Issue2: Vowel clusters.
>
> Currently, any number of non-y vowels are allowed in cmavo,
> fu'ivla and cmene. Syllable breaks after ai, au, ei, oi, ia, ie,
> ii, io, iu, ua, ue, ui, uo, uu or a single vowel.

I'm fine with that.

> Special cmavo: Cy, y'y, y = yy = yyy = yyyy = ...

I like this a lot (I think it's even my fault).

> In cmene, y is allowed freely.

+1


> Issue3: Rafsi
>
> All fu'ivla can be used as final rafsi, and all have a non-final
> rafsi by adding 'y.

s/have a/can be a/ ?

Did you mean {'y} there or {y}?

Can you give an example? How does one distinguish between fu'ivla
lujvo and regular lujvo?

> fu'ivla that start with a vowel add ' in front for non-initial
> rafsi: example mily'enri from milti .enri

Uh. That'll take some getting used to, to say the least.

> cmene can have initial rafsi by adding -iy-

Ditto.

> non-y cmavo can have non-final rafsi by adding 'y

Very ditto.

What about final rafsi for cmavo?

> Issue4: CVC-y- and CVV-r/n- hyphens
>
> These hyphens are allowed always.

+1


> Issue5: doi-la-lai-la'i in cmene
>
> Currently these syllables are not allowed in cmene unless preceded
> by a consonant or followed by a vowel or apostrophe. There is a
> proposal to drop the restriction altogether, and require cmene to
> always begin and end with a pause (as they are required in some
> contexts already).

+1


I want to point out that in 10K words of LNC, much of which is
conversation, I have ~200 instances of "la" and "coi", but over 700
instances of BY. If you consider pauses before and after words to
be too onerous, I think you're not using the language very
effectively WRT pro-sumti.

-Robin