WikiDiscuss

WikiDiscuss


BPFK Section: Epistemology sumtcita

posts: 14214

Forwarded from Adam Lopresto:

Sorry for dumping so many suggestions in at the very end, here.
Aside from the comments about {se ta'i}, I don't think anything that
follows is very important (and I'm not even sure my take on {se
ta'i} is that important, or necessarily right, but....). And none
of them should be enough to hold up voting for the section (which I
just did).

First of all, I wonder whether the template would be less redundant
but just as meaningful with s/the tagged sumti indicates that //.
So a sample definition would be something like

Known by... Tags a sumti as fitting the first place of djuno.
Augments the bridi in which it occurs, adding an extra, un-numbered
place with the meaning of the first place of djuno and then fills it
with the tagged sumti. In other words, the event described by the
bridi is known by the referent of the tagged sumti. See also: djuno,
se du'o, te du'o, ve du'o.

For an example for {zau}, you have

mi cliva zau la patfu

I left with dad's permission.

Probably should be "with Dad's permission". (Dad here being used as
a proper noun, therefore).

{ca'i} has no keywords assigned (just copy "By authority of..." from
the definition)

Is there a reason {ta'i ma do cilre la lojban} is listed as an
example of {ta'i} but not {ta'i ma}, while {ta'i ma do zbasu le
danmo} is listed under both? (And why, oh why, does {ta'i ma} need
a separate definition anyway? Nevermind.)

The proposed definition of {se ta'i} doesn't sit right with me. I
would have expected that it's basically the reverse of {ta'i}.

mi cilre la lojban ta'i lo nu mi'o casnu

mi'o casnu se ta'i lo nu mi cilre la lojban

I learn lojban from our chats.

If that's the case, I would have expect the defintion to be

As a method for... Tags a sumti as fitting the second place of
tadji. Augments the bridi in which it occurs, adding an extra,
un-numbered place with the meaning of the second place of tadji and
then fills it with the tagged sumti. In other words, the tagged
sumti indicates that
the event described by the bridi is a method
associated with doing or performing the actions described or
indicated by the referent of the tagged sumti. See also: tadji,
ta'i, te ta'i, ta'i ma.

That's also much more in keeping with the keyword (which doesn't
mean it's right, but means that if it's not the keyword may need to
be chaged).


Perhaps another keyword for {te ja'i} is "by rule governing"

Possible artificial example sentence for {ku'u} (and {ja'i}, or
actually {ja'i nai}). Feel free to modify or reject it completely,
but maybe it can replace the "this kinda sucks".

lo prenu na pinfu ja'i no da ku'u lo za'i zifre

People are not held prisoner for no reason in a culture of freedom.
(Probably not a really good translation.)

"Proposed Definition of sera'a"

I think you mean "se ra'a" (with a space).

Under "Examples of se tai Usage", you have "See tai above; they are
functionally identical." If so, then why are their definitions
different? It would probably also be handy to note that in the
defitions of each.

mi galfi le ti bolci le ta bolci ve tai lo ka skari

"I turn this ball into that ball with respect to colour."

I have no idea what this means, in either language. But I don't
really understand tamsmi anyway, so I can't come up with anything
better.

For {ma'i}, it might be nice to have a non-cultural example (since I
think that's more in line with the definition).

le mi ckafi cu dukse glare ma'i lo se pinxe

My coffee is too hot, by the standard of drinks.

My coffee is too hot to drink.

Perhaps "under the control of" should be added as a keyword for {ji'o}.

--
Adam Lopresto
http://cec.wustl.edu/~adam/

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